Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hello, and welcome to Storyteller in depth, a podcast where we go behind the scenes to learn more about the school of communications, media arts and designs, people, places, and things. I'm your host, Pat Quigley.
In this episode, we have two very special guests, Talene and Ronnie, graduates of our music industry arts and performance program. If you're interested at all in learning the behind the scenes of what writing and producing music is like, then this episode is definitely for you. Both Talene and Ronnie will share insight into this industry, their tips for songwriters, a background on their experience, and so much more. Let's get into it.
[00:00:47] Speaker B: Thank you so much, both of you, for being on the podcast today.
[00:00:50] Speaker C: Thank you so much for having us.
[00:00:52] Speaker D: Thank you for having us. Great.
[00:00:54] Speaker B: Yeah, no, it's gonna be a great conversation, and there's. There's lots of stuff to cover. So, you know, to kind of start off maybe with you. Ronnie, what initially drew you into your pursue in a career? Music. And how has that passion evolved over time?
[00:01:09] Speaker D: I started off with. So when I was a little kid, my mother introduced me into this indian instrument called tabla, and I would play that, and then that eventually led me into a summer camp at school where I took up keys, and then that kind of meddled into me discovering, like, other instruments. And then I started writing my own stuff.
I think around, like, age of 15, I got into production and started, like, writing my own stuff. I'm classically trained, so that also kind of helped in terms of me being able to translate my ideas then. Yeah, I just kept writing, and then I would, like, listen to bands. I would see, like, live bands and stuff, and I just, like, would inspire me. And, like, one of my favorite bands called Coldplay.
Like, I saw their live concert, and that kind of triggered me into, like, going all the way, like, completely committing myself to music. And then, yeah, just kept kind of, like, kept making music and progressively got better and better and. Yeah, that's. That's, like, hopefully that sums up the question.
[00:02:32] Speaker B: Yeah, no, that's. That's great. And it's cool to find you kind of people where people get their inspiration from, right? Like, yeah, it's really interesting.
[00:02:40] Speaker D: Absolutely. Like, I. For me, it's. It's. It's also, like, people that I came across through music, like, the strongest relationships that I've had are through people that I've discovered, like, through music.
And it's always really interesting because everybody carries their own set of skill set and everybody. Because music is so, like, it's such a huge space where there's people that are technically adapt, people that are creatively adapt, people that lean more towards the artistic side, people that lean, like, are, you know, good with both. And, like, I've picked and chose, like, certain things that have stood out to me, and it's like, I love that. I love that entire community because you can kind of, like, grow off of each other's energy, if that makes sense. Yeah.
So, yeah, like, I've always, like, I'm very grateful that I, like, pursued it because, yeah, like, there was, like, when I. When I brought it up with my parents, there, there was definitely some sort of, like, oh, music, like, how can you make this sustainable? And that, like, those questions popped up and, yeah, like, I was. I was. I was very grateful that I pursued it, basically.
[00:04:08] Speaker B: And how. And how were you telling, like, what drew you into your pursue of music, and how did that passion evolve?
[00:04:16] Speaker C: Yeah, I come from a family of musicians, so having that background as a kid, seeing my own family members pursuing music in their own ways kind of made it feel possible for me. I just didn't, I didn't think there was anything unconventional about it because I had real life examples of people that I knew who all had their own directions and finding their sound and pursuing that in their own ways. So, yeah, it was just a good example for me to understand the possibilities and that you can make it happen.
And, yeah, when I was a kid, I just naturally gravitated towards music. I loved to sing. Anything that happened to me in my life became translated into a song for me to be able to understand it myself and for me to be able to express it.
So it was just a very natural thing. And in my kid brain, I thought, if this is what I love, why don't I do it? It's a huge question when you're a kid and people are asking you, what do you want to be when you grow up? And that question, to me, you have no concept of what you want to be when you grow up means work. To me, that meant, who do you want to be when you grow up? And to me, in that age, that meant doing something that I love. So music was always naturally what I wanted. And as I've gotten older, my love and passion for music has only deepened with more exposure and knowledge. So as I've been exposed to different kinds of music, as Ronnie was talking about, different kinds of people who come from so many different backgrounds, finding the intersection between music and. And visual art and music and fashion, like, there's so much. Music is part of the artistic space so there's so much intersection. So every musical experience I had became another thing to add to my list of why I love music, and I hope that never ends.
[00:06:29] Speaker B: Yeah. And, like, what kind of inspired you? Like, what were there people or were there besides family and that, like, what were some of your other inspirations?
[00:06:42] Speaker C: It's funny, because I feel like it was a very individual experience for me as a kid, where it was just something that I experimented with and just naturally gravitated towards. And then as I got older and I started diversifying the music genres I was listening to, there were certain artists that really inspired me, not only on the music front, but just as human beings. Like, Amy Winehouse was one person that really changed my entire life because she was just so cool and so honest and so raw. And the way that she wrote really resonated with me. So a huge part of music for me, aside from the sound of it, was also the storytelling aspect, which was I. There was a point in my life where I was, like, grappling. Is story. Is writing stories what I want to do, or is singing my stories what I wanted to do? So singing was actually a way of just communicating the stories that I had written, and that was my inspiration.
[00:07:41] Speaker B: That's incredible.
[00:07:42] Speaker D: Wow.
[00:07:44] Speaker B: And, you know, both of you together have collaborated on such this amazing piece called Lumiere. I hope I'm saying that right, and I'm mispronouncing that. Can you share about how you two started working together on the song and the story behind this piece of music?
[00:07:58] Speaker D: Yeah, absolutely. So Tallinn and I met during, what? Like, what was it, year one? I think that's so basically, because this is, like, just. This is pandemic, so, like, nobody knows anyone, right? Like, it's just. It's just virtual squares on your computer. So, like, for the first year, I think, like, we just, like, had, like, one mini conversation and then didn't really get a chance to, like, talk or anything.
It was through our private lessons, I think the ensemble that we did, we performed, and then we had a. We had a moment where we could, like, kind of talk to each other, give each other feedback and stuff, and then it just naturally, we're talking about, like, I think, correct me if I'm wrong, tali, but, like, we were, like, entertaining the idea of, like, possibly doing a collaboration, and we're talking about, like, making something together.
[00:08:54] Speaker C: Yeah, it was just in the Zoom chat box.
[00:08:57] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:08:57] Speaker C: The first. The first introduction to each other's musical world was just an amazing masterclass performance at the end of the first semester where we had the same private lesson teacher, but obviously we had no interaction with each other because these classes were individual based. So then at the very end of the semester, anyone who had that same professor got a chance to do a Zoom showcase of two songs that they had been working on. And that was the first introduction to me seeing him perform and him seeing me perform in a very unconventional way through zoom. And, yeah, in the zoom chat box, we were just like, you're amazing. I love what you did. Let's see if we can figure out a way to put these two worlds together.
[00:09:40] Speaker D: Yeah. And then at the time, like, we were talking about possibly collaborating, and I had. I had made this, like, ethereal, instrumental, like, track, and I was kind of feeling I was having, like, a little bit of writer's block at that time with that particular track. And it was kind of, like, in this, like, draft thing in my computer, and I was like, you know what? I could, like. Your voice kind of gives me that, like, energy of, like, possibly, maybe I'll send this track over to you, and if it, like, resonates with you in any sort of way, we can, like, since we already talked about possibly collaborating, we can, like, let's try with that. Let's see where that leads.
And then I sent you what? I sent you. I sent you the instrumental with the chorus idea, and it was, like, very, very, like, stripped down. It was just the track and just a draft of my vocals.
And. And then I think you had it. I forget for how long. It feels like forever.
You had it with you for a while, and then you sent me the draft of your verse over the phone, if I'm not wrong.
[00:11:07] Speaker C: Yeah, actually, I wrote my verse in that same day. I finished it. I sent it back, and then.
And I sent it back to you immediately. But unfortunately, because of the restrictions that were placed during the pandemic at the time, we could not get together.
[00:11:22] Speaker D: Right.
[00:11:23] Speaker C: Pursue things further. So it existed only in our messages for so long. And when he sent me that beat, I listened to it, and I immediately fell in love with it. I got in my car. It was raining, which is, like, the perfect setting for inspiration, and just parked up in a random parking lot and immediately wrote my verse.
I asked him if he had an idea for the title, and he said, lumiere, and I don't. I just started seeing images in my head, and the words, we were like a shooting star just shot out of my mouth for some reason that is unbeknownst to me. And then the writing just kind of followed, but, yeah, because this was such an untraditional process just because of the nature of the pandemic, so it really only existed in messages for a very long time.
[00:12:13] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:12:13] Speaker C: And then when we did finally get together to record it, that that was actually the very first time that him and I had a chance to properly meet, because we had seen each other only in passing up until that point. So there was so much vulnerability and trust and waiting involved in this entire process that kind of, like, really built it up to be what it became.
[00:12:35] Speaker D: Because we were still in the lockdown, I believe.
[00:12:37] Speaker A: Right.
[00:12:37] Speaker D: And I don't think we were allowed to go outside, if I'm not wrong.
And, yeah, she had sent over the drafts, and then I was like, let's try to schedule a session where we're both free. But, like, once the lockdowns lifted, and that kind of took forever, and, yeah, like, she just mentioned the first time that we met, it ended up becoming, like, a ten hour recording session, I believe. Like, you came at, like, what, like, five something something pm in the evening, and then it just, like, we were up till, what, like, 03:00 a.m. In the morning just, like, recording, like, tracks and overdubs. And, like, I was. I was throwing, like, my ideas to her, and I didn't know how it would end up. Like, I have a particular way of, like, recording. I have a particular way of stacking harmonies and stuff, and I was throwing ideas to her, and then she was throwing ideas back at me, and then it just meddled together because I've had recording sessions where I have stuff prepared, and it just goes south sometimes. You never really know.
[00:13:52] Speaker A: Right.
[00:13:52] Speaker D: With these things. So, yeah, I was super grateful that it worked out the first time. Like, we just met. Uh, and, uh, yeah, pretty much, like, the. The song was, like, 90% done, um, the first time, like, in that ten hour session, and then it was just tweaks. Like, small little tweaks that we just, like, did over the course of years. And then, uh, I think for, like, a year, we just. We were. We were very particular about, like, making sure it sounds really, really good. And we tried to give it a listen from, like, all different sorts of environments, like, technically speaking and emotionally speaking, like, in different, like, spaces, and, yeah, we tweaked it. And then finally, like, this year, we were like, okay, I feel like we're. We can let the song kind of go and let it do its thing.
That's.
[00:14:58] Speaker B: Yeah, it's such a unique experience to create this. This piece through, you know, the pandemic and. And through doing it digitally. Right. Like, doing it, like, how we're doing the podcast now.
What does that, like, the. Like, what is better? What do you guys prefer more? Do you like to work together through, like, this format, or, like, is being together and being, like, in a creative hive mind in one space, like, a. The more best place to be? Yeah.
[00:15:28] Speaker D: I think we can all agree that, like, this is definitely not natural. Like, this is definitely, like, you know, like, it doesn't feel natural, especially because of how organic music is and how it's created, being in person. Definitely. Like, I will choose that over digital all the time. Although I don't get me wrong, there's so many, like, advancements in technology that allows us to record remotely, and very grateful for the, like, technological, like, capabilities that we have nowadays. But, like, to create a song, I'm. I'm leaning towards in person, like, creating it with someone, because that's when you can kind of get a sense of the synergy in the room. And based on that, I think the most organic music comes out through those interactions. I don't. I'm gonna pass it over to Tallinn for her take.
[00:16:25] Speaker C: I think there are certain parts of the process that can be done remotely.
Like, in our case, him writing what felt. What he felt called to when he wrote his part of the song and produced the beat, and then me writing my part, I tend to work. When I'm writing lyrics, I tend to work in isolation, because that just creates the most free process for me to really take all the time that I need and figure out what the message I want to send is, which is not. It can be done with other people, for sure, but I just tend to do that more so by myself. But then if the whole process was done remotely, I don't know what the song would have ended up as. Because once we did get in the room together and we were able to, like you said, create that hive mind and then bounce the ideas off of each other, then it took a whole new form. So there are certain things that you can get the beginnings of on your own. But I do think that having the power of being in the same space and feeling each other's vibes and having conversations where you're like, what were you thinking when you wrote this part? Okay, now I understand that, and now that's gonna change the way that I approach this. Like, there's so the conversations, the feelings that you get it. It's. It takes on a new life when you're in the same space together, for sure. Yeah.
[00:17:51] Speaker B: And, like, what were some of the elements that you guys didn't kind of expect when you were creating this song? And were there any pleasant surprises that kind of came along the way?
[00:17:59] Speaker D: Yeah. The harmonies, like, for the song, like, the harm, like, specifically just the harmonies. Like, I was just, like, riffing off of the top of my head, and, like, if I dive, like, specifically say, like, talking about the piece, I I wrote it down. And then, so prior to her coming, I had prepped the session with, like, stacked harmonies of, like, just my voice, and then have those as, like, reference for her to riff off of. And then she came in, and then she, like, threw in her ideas in there, and then we just stacked him. And it was, like, the first time where I had.
I've done collaborations, but not in this, like, in this model where I have, there's, like, at least 200 to 250 stacks of, like, vocal harmonies.
And, like, I don't know how many takes we did, but it was, like, a ridiculous amount of takes that we. We were, like, trying to perfect every single breath, every single, like, um, like, know, every single execution. I think just the intro of you where you come in with the, like, the poetry line, it took us. We did the whole render of, like, I think, ten to twelve just takes, and then we were like, okay, this sounds kind of good at that moment. And then we rendered it, listened back. I'm like, oh, maybe.
Maybe we can do something better. And then we were just like, you know, you can imagine, like, just keep keeping at it and just refining it as much as we could, and, yeah, like, the harmonies were, like, definitely. I wasn't expecting it to be so dense and so, like, it has so much depth to it. So, like, I'm very proud of, like, that particular section. Proud of the song in general, but that section, I'm like, yeah, the harmonies are. I'm also a bit of a nerd, so, like, I nerd out when it comes to, like, those little notes and stuff.
[00:20:13] Speaker C: And, like I said, we didn't have. We had very limited interactions with each other before this, so going in, you're walking into the complete unknown, so you kind of have no idea what's gonna happen. I had no idea what his process was gonna be like. He had no idea what my process was gonna be like. And we're both coming with different skill sets and different experiences, but I think the biggest surprise to me was that we're both so meticulous, which made this so perfect. Like, he was saying, we. We spent we were both down to spend 10 hours with very small breaks to get it done because we lived in that space of inspiration. We were both down to be experimental and try different things. And there was one specific moment that just, like, really captured the synergy of the experience is there's one part in the song where I'm singing, we've got a cosmic connection. And I looked at Ronnie and I said, I feel like. I feel like there needs to be some kind of twinkle here, and I'm not really sure what twinkle means, but it needs a twinkle. And then Ronnie just looked at me and he said, I know exactly what to do. And in 2 seconds, the twinkle disappeared. It was just. And those are the moments that when I listen back to the song, I am replaying these magical things that happen that you can't expect and that end up making it so personal and so special because it's representative of us both being so free and surrendering to the creative process, especially, like I said, in a vulnerable space with someone that you had no prior familiarity with.
[00:21:57] Speaker D: And it felt natural, too. That's another really important thing for me. It's like, when I'm working with people, if it feels pushy, the music definitely has an impact. Like, it, like, whether you polish it with production and whether you, like, you know, sprinkle in whatever things you can kind of, you know, cover it up with, it will show. Like, people can tell through bad session, people can, like, see through that stuff. So it felt natural, which was really, really important. I feel like, for both of us, because if it didn't, I don't know where the song would have went, but, like, because it did. I think it, like, when we listen back to it, it just. It feels very pure and feels very, like, innate, if that makes sense.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: Yeah, completely. And it's so cool to hear just from the minds of the people who are creating music, right? Like, I don't have a lot of musical bones in my body, and part of me hates that for myself, and. But my wife, very luckily, has that talent. But, you know, it's cool. It's so interesting to. Just to hear people's passions and kind of how they create something from nothing, right? Like, from. From an idea or a spark or a twinkle, as you said, telling, like, you know, it's. It's so cool to me because I don't have that. So, you know, congratulations to both of you for. For this and for everything kind of moving forward.
[00:23:32] Speaker D: Thank you so much.
[00:23:34] Speaker B: Yeah. So both of you were part of the music industry arts and performance program with Centennial college. How did that help you propel you into the industry?
[00:23:44] Speaker D: I feel like for me particularly, I was looking for networking, and that is something that the program really, really helped me with. Like, truth be told, like, if. Like, nowadays, if you want to learn anything, I believe, like, because. Just because of my learning habits, I believe you can teach yourself whatever you want. Like, you don't really particularly need any sort of institution to kind of, like, learn based on my learning habits. Like, just personally speaking, I was not worried about that aspect, but, like, for me, it was like, okay, I want to meet, like, all sorts of people from different backgrounds, and I think that program where everyone is, like, musically inclined, I think I can. And I was right. I did end up making a lot of connections that, like, definitely will, like, last throughout my career. And, like, yeah, like, networking was primarily the goal for me with the program, and that's definitely helped me, for sure.
[00:24:56] Speaker C: For me, I was.
I. What I liked about the program when I was just researching it in the beginning is the fact that it's all encompassing. It really goes over so many different facets of the music industry that may not align with what your original vision was for what you wanted to do musically, but with the exposure of it may inspire you to diversify what you were originally thinking about, or simply just appreciate these aspects.
When I'm watching a movie and I listen to the soundtrack, I appreciate it a little bit differently now than did before, because I know so much of the work that goes into it that I may not have really been thinking about before. So it really just exposed me to so many different processes that I otherwise wouldn't have known so in depth.
Similar to Ronnie, the networking aspect is really important, not only with my peers, but also with the professors, because they are all working within the music industry. So the experiences and the stories that they bring are really valuable to truly understand the landscape from all of their own different experiences. And Centennial has really helped me to propel my career in the sense of giving me paid opportunities to perform while I was in the program, which was a huge game changer for me. And having that platform to be able to share music and to be able to sing, um, introduced me to an even wider audience, which actually gave me connections that I'm still, uh, that I'm still in touch with to this day. So it's. It's just helped me all around, and I couldn't be more thankful for everything. All the fruit of my labor and all of the support along the way, that really helped me.
[00:27:05] Speaker B: And music truly is such a powerful medium, right. It's a powerful medium for storytelling and telling you, you describe that your voice is informed by the world around you and the world that you hold within. Can you share a little bit about what that means to you and how you describe and what you describe as writing for release, singing for expression, and spoken word for communication plays a role in your journey as an artist.
[00:27:33] Speaker C: So, like I said in the beginning, music as a kid was something that I naturally gravitated towards. Music is kind of the lens that I look at life through.
Everything that I encounter in life somehow gets turned into something musical because that's just my way of dissecting it and understanding it and feeling it. So when something happens to me or to. Or I get inspired by someone else's story, or even just a word sends an inspiration my way, or I go for a walk and the way that a tree blows in the wind, like everything to me, my mind immediately goes to music, and a lyric is somehow written, or a soundscape is somehow a seed of a soundscape is placed in my mind, and then it becomes an obsessive thing where I have to create something from it.
And there are specific memories of me as a child when, like, my mom would upset me because I didn't do the chore that I was supposed to do, and now she's mad at me, and now I'm. I would go to my room and I'd play on the keyboard, and I'd write a song, and it would start off as me, like, being all sad because I thought I was a victim, because my mom's mad at me because I didn't do what I was supposed to do. And then after those two minutes of me feeling sorry for myself, it would actually become alchemy in my mind, and I'd be like, okay, I got that out. Now it's time. Now that I'm sitting here, and now that I'm creatively inspired, what can I actually make with this? So it was just always my way of processing things. And then as I got older and I started being in different musical contexts with people who come from different experiences, like, I've started to get more into the world music side of things and also sound as medicine side of things, I've started to see more uses with music that can provide a physical release or an emotional release for someone else. So it's always just been my way of processing things and understanding things and.
[00:29:49] Speaker B: To build off that as well. Like, I know that I listen to music and there's certain songs that I'll listen to, and I'll go, okay, this helps me recenter. This helps me come back to a place of calm, or, you know, if people want to go work out and they have their playlists and all of that kind of stuff. Can you explain a little bit of the work you do to provide therapeutic music in group, in client based settings, as well as the importance of the work you do with mindful movement sessions for patients with physical trauma?
[00:30:20] Speaker C: Yeah, that has been a really exciting world that expanded my view of music altogether.
In group settings, I've used music in various different ways, one of which being, well, all of them have to do with creating improvisational soundscapes with the intention of helping someone else. So there have been instances where somebody comes in and they have an emotional problem that they're trying to work through, and they tell you a little bit about your story. And then as soon a group or me with another musician, we. We create music. But in our minds, we're really trying to.
Every sound that we choose and every melody that I sing is with the intention for helping someone else, which is just a whole different way of approaching music altogether, which is like, just really opened my eyes.
And then in the physical side of things, I collaborated with a physiotherapist assistant, and she had patients that came in with very serious physical trauma. There was one person in particular who was hit by a motorcycle, so the pain that he was constantly in is unimaginable. And I just incorporated sound into the sessions with these patients, which kind of produced really interesting results, where sometimes, because it's so quiet around these people and they're really trying to push through this pain that they're feeling, it becomes a very difficult process. But having the sound involved gives them something to take their mind off of.
So I've seen it provide help for people who are going through physical issues. And then I also volunteered at a social services center in Toronto, where I collaborated with a yoga teacher for a yoga class for women who are new to Canada. And again, providing improvisational soundscapes and using my voice as an instrument without this time, without using any type of words. And it's only melody or vocables, which is basically just like gibberish, which was so interesting and fun for me, because what I saw with those women in general was that they were able to create community that transcended language boundaries, physical boundaries, the experiential and or age gaps. It was just so interesting. And then seeing the way that they related to the music just on the. Everybody can understand the language of music as a whole. And that was something that really taught me and how it can create community. So music, as my view of music just ever expands as I get older and get exposed to more, there's quite.
[00:33:24] Speaker B: A few mediums, right, that can, as you said, kind of cross boundaries and cross language barriers and, you know, food, music, art, expressionism, all of those things. So it's cool to see the more advances that we get through time and to see what we do with it, right? And how that can help provide peace and love and kindness to the world around us as we kind of move forward through turbulent times, through pandemics, you know, all that. So it's awesome to hear the steps you're taking to do that kind of stuff.
[00:34:02] Speaker C: Thank you. Absolutely. To everything you said, ronnie.
[00:34:06] Speaker B: You've got a pretty extensive background in music therapy, and you have a multifaceted role as a producer, an engineer, teacher, technical director, and I don't know what else you probably do. Probably a bunch more. But what aspects of the industry bring you the most joy?
[00:34:21] Speaker D: 100%. It's creating. Like, I love creating. Like, that has to be like. And for me, it's like I have been able to be blessed to be involved in roles where I can let myself be creative. And there are roles like, for example, my role as a technical director. There are certain cues and certain procedures that I have to follow, but where I'm still allowed to be creative, but the way I can express myself is a little restricted versus when I am in my studio mixing an album or creating, like, my own music.
But creating has to be one of the really essential aspects of being involved in the industry that I'm very, very grateful for. The other side of me, like I said, I mentioned, I'm a bit of a nerd, and I like, kind of like, learning and disintegrating. The technological aspect of music, which has been very, very helpful for me to translate ideas and stuff, help saved me a ton, tons of money as well. From, like, the financial aspect of, like, having to book recording sessions and stuff, I engineer myself. I'm able to take care of that. So, yeah, I love kind of like, deducing gear. And, like, that's where my role as an engineer comes in, where I am able to, like, nurture relationships with clients, where I am just there as a catalyst for them to create and feel comfortable. And so, like, those roles, like, help me polish up my technical abilities, which further helped me in the grand scheme of things, of creating and being able to translate all my ideas. So, like, I definitely have to say being able to create is. Is. Is the centerpiece for that question. Yeah.
[00:36:28] Speaker B: I think it's so cool to be able to do all the different pieces of the puzzle. Right. Like, in my job that I have now, I'm able to, you know, write, shoot, edit, broadcast, all of that kind of stuff. So having your finger in each piece of the pie.
[00:36:45] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:36:46] Speaker B: That's got to be so much fun.
[00:36:47] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:36:48] Speaker D: And it also allows you to have perspective. Right. So, like, I have been on the performing end, and when I am mixing live bands, I'm on the other side. So I, like, lots of the times you. You see that, like, people that are only on that one particular side of things, they are less empathetic. And I've had my fair share where I've done shows where the engineer is just like, oh, this is how it is. This is how it'll be.
And that's a common thing.
But, like, yeah, it helps you to kind of relate to different positions and understand where you stand in that particular moment within that particular role.
Yeah. Like, I've been working as a technical director for a while, and for all the bands that have come, I've gotten, like, like, positive, like, reviews about the fact that they had a good time.
[00:37:45] Speaker B: They.
[00:37:45] Speaker D: They were like, oh, this is very rare. We don't get people that are understanding of our musical needs when we're performing. Like, it's very rare. And I'm like, yeah, like, I've been on the other side, so, like, it kind of helps. Same thing with, like, writing songs. Right. Like, when I am taking the help of some. Like, some of my friends that are also, like, engineers or producers, like, they give me ideas as to how to, like, facilitate my ideas and, like, bring them to fruition. So, like, I feel like it's. It really allows you to have perspective and understand the importance of every role and where you stand in. Within that role.
[00:38:30] Speaker B: Yeah, no kidding. And from both of your perspectives and experiences, you know, what advice would you give to someone who wants to release their own music? And is there anything you wish you'd known when you started out?
[00:38:42] Speaker D: Definitely.
It is very.
There's certain technical things that are really, really, I guess, annoying, at least for me. There's troubleshooting and all of that stuff. I know it's not optimal. I know it's not ideal. When I got into music, I got into music solely because of the fact that I wanted to create, and I just wanted it to be out. But the reality is that you have to be able to diversify, especially if you're in the music and arts industry. Like, you have to be able to diversify in order to kind of make it sustainable. And, like, especially when it comes to releasing music, if you want to do it efficiently and consistently, unless you have a really consistent budget coming in from somewhere, if you're on your own and you want to do it as an independent artist, I would definitely say sharpen up your skills as an engineer, as a producer. Try to learn skills, even if at the time, it seems like, oh, this is nowhere near what I am trying to do. Be open to the idea of being able to discover something that might be useful for you to create something at the end. Um, yeah, like, definitely, definitely explore recording, uh, proper recording, like, professionally. Learn micing techniques. Learn, uh, the. The technicalities of, like, processing sound and, like, editing, mixing, mastering. Like, if not, dive it. Dive in. Like, with, uh, like, full on, like, four years of, like, dedicated learning. At least try to, like, learn about it in a holistic sense because it definitely helps you. Like, I'm nowhere. Like, I'm not Rick Rubin, but, like, you know, I have. I have always, like, looked at musical, like, concepts as, like, okay, how can I use this to my advantage? And so far, it's. It's helped me, like, as a technical director. Like I said, I started learning about color schemes and lighting.
That's nowhere related to what I do, but that will help me eventually. If I'm doing cover shoots or if I'm doing shows and I need to design a show, I know what exactly to do. Right. So, yeah, entertaining ideas that might not seem.
That might not make sense at the time.
Give it a chance. Give it a chance. Try to see what you can make of it and try to incorporate it within the path you're trying to take for releasing music. It's very important, I believe.
[00:41:41] Speaker C: Absolutely. Keeping an open mind is such a huge asset to you, and it will take you in directions that you could never possibly imagine.
My biggest advice is don't. Don't be so focused on the outcome that the journey becomes debilitating so much of the musical, so much of just a musical life, because music truly is a lifestyle.
When musicians are working all the time, they're not just working when they're in the studio. They're not just working when, like, if Ronnie's doing. If he's doing the technical work for a show, he's not just working when he's on the clock, he's working at home. Because we're working at home, we're thinking of things to write, we're processing how we're feeling, and we're transmuting that into music. We're learning about music. So you have to find a way to enjoy every step of the process, because there are only so many moments where you're able to really sit back and enjoy the outcome. But the majority of your life, if you are dedicated to being a musician, is simply just the process. So you have to fall in love with the beauty and the pain and the annoyance of all of that.
That's my biggest advice. And just simply not limiting your creative inspiration. Take inspiration from wherever you can find it. Take knowledge from wherever you can find it, because one day down the road, you will be so surprised. This is piggybacking off of what Ronnie said. One day down the road, you will be surprised at how that one moment where you learned something that you thought would never benefit you will come in handy. So. But for the most part, enjoy the ride.
[00:43:36] Speaker D: Enjoy the process, right? That's what matters. Like, don't get caught up with, like, oh, like, streams and all that. Just, like, do you like the song? Do you like the song that you've made? If you like it, let it out. And, yeah, like, you might as well do that instead of doing something that is not. Like, doing something that's not genuine to you.
[00:43:56] Speaker B: Right?
[00:43:56] Speaker D: Like, oh, this is what's top 40? Whatever this is, like, out there. I'm gonna have to try to conform algorithms. Whatever. Like, just create. Don't worry about it. Just make your stuff that feels genuine to you, because when you look back, it's like a picture memory of, like, oh. Like, you will have the moments where you're like, okay, this is. I never kind of, like, you know, worried about anything else other than just creating. And that's what I think music is. Especially if you are a creator. Just create fearlessly. That's what I'll say.
[00:44:33] Speaker B: It's almost like the complete other side of the process. Right? Like, you've got the creative side, and then you've got the business side, which is the streams, knowing what, you know, does the Spotify releases or the Apple music, or whatever it might be.
[00:44:46] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:46] Speaker B: You know, and so just that two different worlds within this combined world of music.
[00:44:53] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:44:54] Speaker B: You know, definitely look towards the creative side. Improving yourself first. Right.
[00:45:00] Speaker D: Yeah. That said, like, yeah, like, don't, you know? That doesn't mean that we are, like, everybody has bills to pay. Like, you have to look at it from a business perspective as well. But, like, yeah, if you can find that middle ground of, like, okay, I am creating genuine stuff, and I will do everything in my power to equip myself with the knowledge to be business. Like, from a perspective of business, being able to adapt to the market and market the stuff that is genuine to me and just let it out, like, see where that leads and find efficient ways. And there's always some way to make ends meet if you are, like, looking for the ways and if you are, like I said, keeping an open mind, that has allowed me to find so many opportunities. I've done post production, video editing, like, stuff that nothing. It's not related to music at all, but I've found different things that I'm passionate about because I've, you know, because I was open about it.
So, yeah, for sure, like, have a fine balance, but, yeah, lean more towards creation.
[00:46:16] Speaker C: And within the business world, have some things that are just for you. Because if every single piece of music that you're making is with the intention of putting it out and having some kind of commercial success there, there, it's going to be a pretty bleak process where you can lose the passion and the fire that started your motivation to be in music to begin with. So don't. Don't make every single little thing that you write or produce or create.
Don't have the intention be to receive accolades from it. And it's okay to just have something, a silly little song that's just for you, that you enjoy.
[00:46:58] Speaker B: Yeah, that's good. So, what's next for you guys? Are you. Are you gonna collaborate on something new? Like, what's. What's the future hold for both of you?
[00:47:07] Speaker D: We were. We were definitely thinking about doing some more.
We.
We haven't. There's nothing concrete at the moment.
I'm pretty sure Talian's doing her own projects. I have released a few of my songs, as well. Um, but there is definitely, like, we brainstormed about, like, doing something in a different. In the r and b.
Well, like, soul, neo soul esque like vibe that we were going for. Uh, but it's still in the works. We'll. We'll see where that goes.
But, yeah, like, uh, Tallien's dealing with her own projects. I'm doing my own for now, but, uh, there's definitely. I'm definitely open to the idea, for sure.
[00:47:54] Speaker C: Yeah. And we are performing Lumiere on April 10 at Hughes room as part of the centennial music industry arts and performance ensemble showcase.
So if you would like to see it live, we will be there on April 10. And yeah, there will definitely be more to come in the future.
[00:48:14] Speaker B: Awesome. Well, Ronnie Tallinn, thank you so much for being on the podcast today. It was wonderful to dive into your minds and learn more about music and all that. So thank you so much.
[00:48:23] Speaker D: Thank you so much for having us.
[00:48:25] Speaker C: Thank you. Yeah, this was really fun. Thank you so much for listening and for sharing. This has been a really great experience.
[00:48:39] Speaker A: This was such a great conversation. Their industry insight was very interesting to hear. So be sure to check out their single lumiere on whatever platform you listen to music. And be sure to head over to our Instagram at Story Artcenter to let us know what you thought of this episode. Until next time, I'm your host, Pat Quigley, and this is storyteller in depth.
